On marriage, divorce, and birthrates

In the vidchat of November 10, 2023, Dr. Farrell @vardas3 remarked that he’d be interested to hear Giza members’ opinions on the following questions:

Why is finding a spouse so difficult these days?
Why are so many marriages unhappy?
Why is there such a high divorce rate?
Why is there a falling birthrate?

I’ll take a stab at it. I don’t know much about traditional relationships, but I’ve definitely noticed and thought a lot about changes in how people meet, treat each other, and approach dating, relationships, and marriage. So, in no particular order:

Reason #1: Decline of religion and everything traditional

This is the obvious one. I’m observing it from the outside, yet it’s clear to me. Looking at the state of the Western world, I’m more and more persuaded that some traditional values are indispensable to a well-ordered society.

I’d say traditional values about respecting commitments need to be restored: respect of one’s commitments in general, but especially commitments to one’s relationship, spouse, and children. When it comes to sexual matters and marriage between adults, I believe deviation from the norm should be tolerated and not persecuted. However, a functional society has to be organized around the norm, or the majority. That’s consistent with the principle of majority rule with reasonable protection of minorities’ rights – the cornerstone of the American form of government, or so I thought. Today’s woke nutjobs, and the politicians who pander to them, are trying to make small minorities the main focus of society and the overriding basis for public policy. That just doesn’t work.

I’m not best placed to comment on the decline of religion. Clearly, though, adherence to religious beliefs did create a respect for marriage, which has declined dramatically.

Reason #2: Demonization of (heterosexual) men

I wasn’t around when the feminist movement first got going strong, and I never thought much about it. I won’t let that stop me from speculating: I suspect there is/was a radical type of feminism that’s little more than the politicization of some people’s personal animus toward men. The time when feminism came into vogue may be when the demonization of men started. I’d have thought “equality” meant equal treatment of – and mutual respect between – men and women, not hatred of one for the other . . .

More recently, the notions of “toxic masculinity” and (allegedly rampant) “rape culture” somehow became fashionable. Of course, there are abusive men and rapes, but I’ve never had the impression these had reached epidemic levels or become the norm. Yet it seems an inordinate number of women now live in fear that every heterosexual man is a likely predator. In some cases, a man merely looking at a woman or initiating a conversation with her is seen as aggression. That atmosphere is hardly conducive to finding spouses.

Now, imagine boys and young men growing up surrounded by the message that, if they’re heterosexual, they’re basically monsters. Where that’s happening, a lot of men are going to end up feeling awful about themselves, about masculinity, and about being and acting male. They’re going to have a severe lack of self-confidence, which is neither attractive nor conducive to taking the initiative to ask a woman out on a date.

Reason #3: Technology

I’ll put birth-control pills, other forms of contraception, and abortion in this category. Regardless of one’s opinion on these things, they’re an obvious cause of declining birth rates.

Now, a perhaps less obvious issue: the internet and smartphones. There are cases where people have met the love of their life online. However, these technologies have also had a negative effect on dating and relationships.

Online communication has drastically diminished face-to-face interaction. This has had several deleterious effects, too numerous to rehearse here. But, for one thing, it’s now common for people to initially “meet” online, via a website or smartphone app. These mediums have transformed dating into the equivalent of an online shopping session, wherein any individual is but one product among hundreds of others you can scroll through. In the same way you might expect to go online and find the perfect new piece of furniture – one that’s exactly the right color, size, material, and price for you – many people have the unrealistic expectation of finding their ideal companion online. They are then unwilling to make overtures to anyone who appears less than absolutely perfect.

Massive amounts of easily available online porn have also gotten men used to effortlessly obtaining their every fantasy. They now expect reality to conform to fantasy. I’m hardly a puritan, but once again, even I can see this leads to unrealistic expectations and dissatisfaction with the reality of dating and marriage.

Reason #4: Economic incentives

Nowadays, you’re lucky if two jobs can support two people. In a family, both parents usually have to work. Extended families don’t stick together like they used to, so it’s not expected that Grandma or Aunt So-and-So will watch the kids while the parents are at work. Aunt So-and-So is probably away at work all day herself. Feminism went from freeing women from the home to chaining them to their job – whether they want it or not. Daycare costs a fortune. All this adds up to a strong economic disincentive to having children.

Another economic disincentive to getting married and having children is the legal system. I think a lot of men see marriage and children as a risk not worth taking: they fear that, in case of divorce, the court will automatically side with the woman, and the man will end up economically worse off. That’s not to mention the other complications involved in a divorce, such as child custody issues.

Reason #5: An unhealthy, unhappy society

American society is unhealthy, mentally and physically. Drug abuse is widespread. The medical system often keeps people sick. Many are stressed by economic problems or by their (one or more) jobs. We’re blasted with negative messages from the propatainment media on a daily basis. For these and other reasons, many people are unhappy and unhealthy; unhappy, unhealthy people don’t form happy marriages. Also, sperm counts are declining for some reason, and this must be having an effect on birthrates.

Reason #6: The Malthusian cult

More and more indoctrinated kids and limousine liberals are buying into the narrative that humans are a cancer on the planet. The anti-humanity cult, so beloved of our Malthusian elites, has progressed so far that people are guilt-tripped into thinking it’s immoral to bring children into the world. There’s another contributor to the falling birthrate.


That’s quite a good list, Fiatlux, and I agree with all of the items, particularly numbers 2 and 4, and I would add to your list, particularly with respect to those two points, the favoritism of law toward women in divorce courts, and sexual harassment cases. Some years ago there was a movie, I forget the name, with Michael Douglas and Demi Moore, where the typical male-on-female harassment roles were reversed, and with his struggle to be believed by “the system.” Add to that double standard factor the role of male “risk assessment” when contemplating marriages, and I think it becomes rather obvious why we’re experiencing declining birth rates, marriages, increasing divorces, and so on.


Here is The Heritage Foundation’s latest Marriage and Family Issue:

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I don’t know if I’m invited to the line-up here but I’m going to swat at it anyway.

No need to break down the 4 points as they are all related to family structure. Family is the basis for all civilization everywhere on this planet. All societies are based on family and in order to break down societal strength, family must be dismantled and that’s exactly what is happening, by the so-called elite; that’s, if you believe there’s a plot, which I do.

I think it was Marcus Aurelius who said something along the lines of, “An empire fails when men become weak, women become strong and children become unruly”. The biggest difference nowadays is it’s not the taking down of just one empire but all of them simultaneously, most especially obvious in The West. Due to lack of communications, Asia, Africa and other less developed locations took slightly longer.

For a list, maybe something on the order of: WW2, dreamtime life in US, inflation & debt to continue dreamtime, both parents forced to work (men weakened, women strengthened), children on their own (become unruly), disregard of family structure disguised as freedom, technology…

Charly said it best.


Thanks thebeaver, for the Marcus Aurelius quotation, which aptly sums up where we are today. Interesting too, the comment about inflation and materialism/consumerism… you’re on to something there, and the two-income family…I heartily agree.


FiatLux, yes, thank you – and if those explanations don’t account for the variance, there is overt genocide. The People who are still families – and know how to exist as families – are permitted neither the spiritual nor geographical space in which to live. (Children are fully half of Gaza’s population). A tutorial in blood to the onlooking world:

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This post is from a woman.
I wanted to share my thoughts. I hated feminism and it’s effect on women which I now see as overwhelmingly negative, gets more degraded everyday. Women are dissuaded from being their natural god given selves. A stay at home mother is seriously frowned upon, since I gave up my city sales jobs supporting children because their mother’s are working has become popular and reasonably well paid work. Mothers can’t wait to get back to work. It’s very sad. Women are not even encouraged to look feminine, fashion is disgusting and I now look for stylish dresses and skirts and petite shoes because I like them and to feel feminine. We are also being made to act like men in our language as well as our behaviour and I find this abhorrent.
As for finding a partner, this has become near impossible. When I was in my 30s I saw the dating online revolution start and now it has taken over. I detest the shallow, artificial, business like way of these sites where one is reduced to a commodity. They are just horrible.
Religion has changed and the new forms of religion are proving problematic. The Jewish religion has seriously fragmented and although Jews are getting married there has been an increase in orthodox Jews, mainly Chabad, this is not good from any perspective. The women are suppressed, abused and the children are neglected, you won’t hear about as the communities are very wealthy and guard their privacy. So religion is not always the answer. I am not a feminist but these women certainly need emancipation.
I have also noticed anger in men towards women on the rise. I have noticed that some men have no manners or breeding anymore when it comes to talking to a woman. Recently I had to call the police to report a workman who was working next door because of the highly personal nature of the abuse he was directing at me. It felt very frightening as he knew it was my home. The migrant men are extremely offensive and quite frankly, scary.


A big problem to me is the need for women to go it alone and on being a mother. I don’t agree with this. I am seeing an increase in women having babies with multiple fathers or e en more distressing going for iVF and then going straight back k to work. Obviously none of these woman are married,

This isn’t new to members here but is being posted nonetheless as a reminder.

Communism’s 45 goals were read into the Congressional Record by Congressman Albert S. Herlong Jr., (D-Florida), in 1963. These goals were gleaned from the testimony given to Congress by scholars and from the writings of current or former Communists.

  1. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.
  2. Get control of the schools and teachers’ associations. Soften the curriculum.
  3. Gain control of all student newspapers.
  4. Infiltrate the press.
  5. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV and pictures.
  6. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and press.
  7. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in the media.
  8. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, and healthy.” 9. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with “social” religion.
  9. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the grounds that it violates the principal of “separation of church and state.”
  10. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate and old-fashioned.
  11. Discredit the American founding fathers as selfish aristocrats [and racists].
  12. Belittle American culture and discourage the teaching of American history.
  13. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.
  14. Infiltrate and gain control of big business and unions.
  15. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as mental health or social problems.
  16. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.
  17. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents.
  18. Repeal the Connally Reservation, allowing the World Court jurisdiction over nations and individuals alike.

From the Ethan Allen institute:


Thank you, @Marcusmojo00 , for speaking to the feminist movement from a lady’s point of view. You have touched on different points in this complex subject, including also what’s been happening in the religions.

I didn’t quite understand your point about your giving up city sales jobs supporting children because their mothers are working? If you can elaborate on that point, that would help me to understand what you meant there.

I, too, have not been comfortable with the ideology of the particular aggressive feminist movement to which we’ve been exposed (despite acknowledging that there have been horrendous justice issues throughout history that have harmed women in various cultures and epochs; e.g., Afghanistan: Women's Rights in Afghanistan: "Before" and "After" America's Destructive Wars - Global ResearchGlobal Research - Centre for Research on Globalization ), even from the time of my university years, when that stuff was being pushed into our faces on campuses – and then throughout my working years, when there were all kinds of reverse discriminatory practices that led to people with inappropriate and inadequate skill sets being placed into managerial positions for ideological reasons rather than reasons of skill and competence. That was a trial balloon for what has evolved into a full-fledged perverted wokery culture which practices reverse discrimination to claim that is the way to heal past injustices practiced against women (and other persons of so-named “identities”). Perverted sophistry at best. Designed to tear and keep us apart.

The really perverted part of this “feminist” movement is, for us in Canada – many of the Public Death Officers who work for Canadian federal and provincial Public Death Departments – who imposed injection and masking policy mandates that harmed many people – are WOMEN!!! This is shocking, because a woman’s most basic internal instinct has been, and should be, to nurture and care for others. And somehow, this instinct has been perverted (as have many of our other basic natural instincts), and we have women now firing the policy shots that bring harm, instead of caring, to others, including the most vulnerable people.

If the engineered harsh feminist movement has felt wrong, then that is because something inside our hearts, some inner truth wisdom has recongized it as being wrong. I hope that a way to heal these perverted ways in which people are treating one another, could be to find ways to get back in tune with our inner intuition which is being suppressed by cultural forces, and get away from mainstream culture altogether, and live on the fringes, and simply create our own caring culture through meaningful friendship. And finding ways to spread joy to others in whatever ways we can do that.


The last story of Alice Marriott’s book”The Ten Grandmothers” is about the children born within the fence. She is referencing her grandchildren as well as the buffalo. Spear Woman says, “Of course you don’t understand…you don’t remember. You were born inside the fence.” When I listen to Dr. Farrell talk about St Augustine and the consequences to all of us I think about this story.


Prophecies from Isaiah regarding Judah’s coming destruction from the Babylonians ring true today; Aerulius’ statement aligns well with verses 4 and 12.

Isaiah 3 (NKJV)
For behold, the Lord, the Lord of hosts,
Takes away from Jerusalem and from Judah
The stock and the store,
The whole supply of bread and the whole supply of water;

2 The mighty man and the man of war,
The judge and the prophet,
And the diviner and the elder;

3 The captain of fifty and the honorable man,
The counselor and the skillful artisan,
And the expert enchanter.

4 “I will give children to be their princes,
And babes shall rule over them.

5 The people will be oppressed,
Every one by another and every one by his neighbor;
The child will be insolent toward the elder,
And the base toward the honorable.”

6 When a man takes hold of his brother
In the house of his father, saying,
“You have clothing; You be our ruler,
And let these ruins be under your power,”

7 In that day he will protest, saying,
“I cannot cure your ills,
For in my house is neither food nor clothing;
Do not make me a ruler of the people.”

8 For Jerusalem stumbled,
And Judah is fallen,
Because their tongue and their doings
Are against the Lord,
To provoke the eyes of His glory.

9 The look on their countenance witnesses against them,
And they declare their sin as Sodom; They do not hide it.
Woe to their soul!
For they have brought evil upon themselves.

10 “Say to the righteous that it shall be well with them,
For they shall eat the fruit of their doings.

11 Woe to the wicked! It shall be ill with him,
For the reward of his hands shall be given him.

12 As for My people, children are their oppressors,
And women rule over them.
O My people! Those who lead you cause you to err,
And destroy the way of your paths.”

@thebeaver We read Flowers for Algernon in middle school, but I never saw the whole movie. Thank you for the clip.

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Fiat: Many, many thanks for your deeply insightful post. I think you are bang on with your points, and I think this is an important topic for all human beings, everywhere.

For some years now, we have been disturbed when going into the city, seeing so many people who look unhappy and unhealthy, and the general “sleep walking” mode, where people do things that impact others, without even thinking about those impacts.

And, in some ways, too, I wonder to what extent our living through our wallets (where many of our human interactions seem to have become nothing more than momentary “transactions”) may have helped foster this. We often don’t think about, when we take out our wallets and pay for something, what processes, actually, are we paying for? (i.e., harms that we pay others to do to others, to gain certain conveniences and pleasures, that aren’t thought about, and that may not be in line with our basic instincts).


I have made sure that ‘Charly’ is among the films that the kids I babysit view at some time during their stay. It is a must see, IMO.


IMO this is an integral part of The Plan. Confuse Needs and Wants, causing massive personal debt.

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When I worked in sales, traditional feminine qualities were not allowed or scewed in such a way to only benefit the client relationship. I was simply not hard enough or competitive enough to succeed and even though I took a massive pay drop I ended up supporting children with learning difficulties in schools. Now I also work as a nanny because the mothers work full time and are not around for their children. It’s ironic that women are working to pay women to care for their children. Quite silly really. For me, it’s great work as I am giving those children some personal, individual attention and saving them from the dreadful after school clubs, which if they attended would mean 11-12 hour days in school.


The continuous war between the sexes? That once upon a time was sparked.In the mists of time. For a reason that is still elusive by nature for the human mind.
One might ask himself or herself the following:

  1. Do males deep down consider females as human beings or not,and are they to be or not to be?
  2. Do females deep down consider males as human beings or not,and are they to be or not to be?

Not deal breakers but extremely crucial. Those are 2 variables I pondered as a young man. Saw many divorces where I worked. When I asked why they were still single my friends would simply say I’m not splitting my stuff again. Child support and alimony? Did not peel the scab off those wounds.

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Yup that was essentially my reasoning at the time… I would have risked what little I did have to get married.


I was in the same boat, but I was one of the ones that ‘got away’.

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