On marriage, divorce, and birthrates

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Simple, direct and to the point message. The speaker is the quintessential ideal of a woman. Perfect.

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That little child is very lucky to have you in her life, at this point in time. It may be that you are one of her few friends, that bring momentary dignity to her day (even though you are, ironically, being paid for your service to her).

I cannot understand why people have children mindlessly and without intent to care for them properly. When we walk about, and see people dragging their kids and tethered dogs, all the while with their noses and minds fully absorbed into these infernal hand-helds, we have to wonder – why are people having kids when they don’t attend to them? And then mindlessly giving over handhelds and computers and tvs and institutions to the kids, to serve as their surrogate parents.

If someone like yourself, who cares about neglected kids that are being shoved off to others for their upbringing, steps into their lives on a momentary daily basis, these poor kids have some solace.

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We’ve seen, though friends, family, and colleagues and acquaintences, all of the scenarios that you good folks have been sharing on this thread.

We’ve seen worn out women in abusive homes, afraid of their husbands’ tempers, turned into servants that jump at the command, and that get smacked about like rags, and if not physically, they get insulted incessantly. We’ve seen men who have dreadfully toxic wives who also insult their dignity and yell and scream and put them down (and have let themselves be marched to injection sites just to try to keep peace with these women). We’ve seen men whose wives have had affairs and divorced their husbands and then cleaned them out of their hard earned savings and assets (including their pensions). We’ve seen both men and women, married to toxic partners, then divorced, then stuck with new toxic partners of the same ilk.

I asked one friend (in her 60’s) why she didn’t marry, and she responded: “I don’t want to cook and clean for some guy”. It could be that she saw what we saw with some of the dreadful marriages, and then she maybe thought that all marriages would be like that. (I do think, however, that the cooking and cleaning is an important part of marriage, if one wants to stay healthy and keep one’s family healthy.

And, knowing men who have been cleaned out of their assets through divorces, we can understand some mens’ reluctance to get involved with anyone.

I am one of the fortunate ones who landed a happy marriage, but I agree with Beaver: If one doesn’t find a suitable partner (at the very least, whose values are in alignment with one’s own), then it is wise to remain alone, and would say in that case to focus on building some solid friendships. Everyone needs companionship of some sort, be it through marriage or friendship, and all of us need to take time out everyday, to be a good friend to someone (including animals) in some way. But no one, absolutely no one, needs any toxic relationship in one’s life.

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This is an interesting reference you describe where your friend said that reason to not be married is to not have to cook and clean for “some guy,” lol.

One challenge with living with someone else is definitely keeping a house in good condition, some people like cooking and it can be better to cook for many people at once rather than just making one meal portion at a time. A difficulty is with some cooks who want other people to clean up after them, while that can be considered a reasonable trade isn’t always fair to everyone.

Especially if someone wants to cook all meals every day and expects the other person to clean up all of their dishes after that every single day at the end of the day, that gets tiring. Can be better to share responsibility of cooking and then have reason to not use so many dishes unnecessarily for that.

It’s a challenge alright, for some people, negotiating the cooking and cleaning.
It wasn’t for us, though – each of us somehow gravitated to our “chores” without even speaking about it, and we’ve never felt that one was doing more than the other. (When one gets sick, then the other takes over all of the housework until the one recovers). That gives us plenty of time to enjoy our company, hiking, yoga, dancing, and reading (and discussing) Dr. Farrell’s books – as both of us do chores, and then we’ve got free time to enjoy each other’s companionship.

One friend married young, and before she married, her fiance told her: “I’m not into cooking and cleaning. If you marry me, you’re going to have to do all the housework.” That would have been an immediate divorce in the engagement, had I been wearing those shoes, but she was so very in love, and didn’t see herself on the Niagara River, heading towards Niagara Falls. Most tragically, her marriage failed when her kids were toddlers, as she had to look after the housework, hold down a full-time job, and look after the kids, as well as her aging parents, while her husband indulged in an affair because his tired wife had no time for him.

So, indeed, the cooking and cleaning is an important part of marriage, and in some cases, it breaks the marriage when one person is burdened with more of it than can be handled. That is why I think there is something to that idea that one person stays home to look after the household, if people can find some way to do that, or perhaps even incorporate someone into the household to help out. (Our vet came to that arrangement with her husband. She was the high income earner, and they didn’t want their kids babysat, so he stayed home and looked after the kids and all the chores and home repairs, while she brought in the income.)

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Cooking meals is a completley different category of a task to “cleaning,” as in dusting or cleaning dishes/floors.

I haven’t been married myself but my icelandic step-mom is a pro cook her brother teaches culinary science.

Believe the movie was named ‘Disclosure’. It had a terribly convoluted plot that many folks could not really explain or enjoy including me. I have a digital copy of it on one of my computers but have unsuccessfully tried to finish watching it. If you have the ‘stomach’ for it here is a review…

(Disclosure (1994 film) - Wikipedia)

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No way didn’t know they made a movie of that, was an unusual book.

Basically in the book (spoiler alert) they tried to frame someone for fradulent charges in court but failed.

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Do you know the name of the ‘movie’, and where it can be found for my viewing? Thanks!!!

Looks like movie name is same as name of the book (Disclosure).

Would check library first / thrift stores might have copy of that.

Here is the larger problem: take an androgenous being, then divide that creature. One part into a man, the other part into a 'wo’man. Then blame everything bad or evil on the woman because she had knowledge of what is good and what is the opposite of ‘good’, i.e. Evil. Make the 'wo’man subservient to the man, give her no birthright, or voice in how we should live together in peace, sharing and that sort of ‘stuff’.

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I was all dressed up to read the Scriptures at a wedding Mass today. I had rushed through two earlier events to be there ahead of time, to check microphone, get instructions from the priest, coordinate with musicians, etc. Just routine for me, really. Well, Nidster, the church was packed, the musicians filled in song after song because … yes, the Bride was late, stuck in traffic! This is California! Your build commute time into your schedule … especially your wedding. Well, all the pain went away when her beautiful countenance appeared, an attendant tidying her long train, the groom beaming, the little kids adorable, dressed like fairies scattering petals . . .

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All is well that ends well. So glad to hear you have good news! Now I would like to say this, not all scripture is ‘bad’. For the most part it is good, and “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

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Speaking as one of (at least) the two of us here who have been blessed with long, amazing marriages, Nidster . . .yes and yes.

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Make that three here.

I had a positive end to marriage; till death do you part. Just shy of 24 wedded years together, my childhood crush passed away at home.

I say positive end because I view divorce as a negative end, the severity of which varies greatly. I don’t know what betrayal feels like, but two of my siblings found their spouses cheating on them and they were miserable and permanently impacted.

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Sharick: Both John and myself are very, very sorry to hear about the loss of your beloved spouse (whenever that happened). It sounds like you were one of the very lucky ones, blessed with a good spouse, which makes the loss very, very painful.

I know some lawyers who are still law partners even after their divorce, they are still on good terms.

@sunnyboy Thank you both for the condolence. Yes, I was blessed with a great spouse.

Yes, we are blessed to be 40+ years into our marriage, and we are still in love, and growing closer all the Time.

The sad part is that after spending 2 ‘extended visits’ in Antarticia all of my best friends who were with me have passed over, so I consider myself to be tremendously blessed.

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